bladder Botox overdose

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I think I somehow have it even though I didn’t get any more Botox than usual. For those of you who’ve had too much Botox before or for whom it went negatively, can you please describe to me what it *felt* like? Did it hurt? Did your bladder hurt? Did you feel like you had a UTI? My urologist told me I had a UTI but it turned out I didn’t. I think it’s got too much Botox. I’ve already taken two antibiotics just in case it was a UTI and they still told me it wasn’t a UTI so I did all that for nothing.
 
P.S. I’m terrified. There’s no way I can self-catch. I’ve had ovarian cysts rupture a whole bunch of times, I’ve passed kidney stones large and small before, but it didn’t feel like this. I’ve had yeast and bladder infections before, and it didn’t feel like this. I’m at my wits end. I’ve now seen three doctors about this and none of them can tell me what’s going on.
 
@snow, You may remember I'm a male. I hope this has value to your concern. I had my first time Botox injection five weeks ago. I was amazed at how it changed things. I had to strain to go pee. The amount of pee was much less than was normal for me. I went back to my urologist and was told I had a little urine still in my bladder, 119 cc's. That's called "residual urine." I was told it should cause a UTI. Previously to Botox, I had always totally emptied. Since the injection, I have been drinking at least 60 fluid ounces of water every day. I was told this is normal because my overactive bladder muscle is now "relaxed." I feel like I have UTI, but when I give a urine sample there is no evidence of one.

Given that you've seen your urologist, who I assume you trust, I wonder if there is some gynecological issue. I'm no doctor, but given your long history of medical issues would that be worth checking out?

Wishing you improvement.
 
I’m sorry to hear about your situations. I’ve avoided Botox even as my urologist says it’s the next line of treatment I should consider. These issues are my concern and he said they are super rare under one percent but to me it just never seemed worth the risk - what’s worse? Dealing with uncontrolled OAB or living with the effects of Botox overcorrecting?
 
@fleemoore Are you self cathing with ~100ml residual urine? I'm going in today and I'm thinking I'm going to be told I have retention. I had 100 units of botox and my experience is starting to be the same as yours. I have to strain and push so hard to get more than a trickle out.

@Newbie2this That's something I'm thinking about in hindsight. I'm hoping things straighten out, but I'm going to have to weigh the pros and cons against a second procedure.
 
@snow I have no answer to the Botox thing - but I have heard of other people with urine retention issues after taking Botox, so it might be the problem. I can only advice you to check with your urologist or call for a second opinion. I think it is common that if a specialist have an opinion, they are not easily changing their mind.

But I am with you - I have briefly read the what you have been through the last couple of weeks - and you have enough. If there was anything I could say or do to help… But it seems like you have good people around you - and I am impressed by your strength and fighting spirit. You are strong and you can handle what is thrown at you.

But I hope that you are soon able to tell us that your condition is improving and not the opposite.

Warm thoughts and wishing you a speedy recovery!
 
@snow my medical team now, also do cultures also, and many times when the first test didnt show anything the culture did, I do know one PA lectured a check in nurse, that if I call the ER, he needs to come in.

Botox, when I had them everything to me felt normal till the Botox kicked in a few days, my urinary retention went way up and also my anxiety.

Also If I do have a UTI, I also get yeast infections also. so I must use Nystatin cream right away, and ordered to clean and reapply 3 times per day at each change.

Also along with this my PCP, and Urology PA told me to use my Diazepam suppositories also.

Boom
 
@lorumipsum, you wrote:
Are you self cathing with ~100ml residual urine? No, I am not self-cathing. I'm going in today and I'm thinking I'm going to be told I have retention. I had 100 units of botox and my experience is starting to be the same as yours. I have to strain and push so hard to get more than a trickle out.

I was told the remaining 119 ccs/mls was not a concern from the doctor's nurse who said this was normal. Frankly, I don't understand why that much urine should remain. Before the Botox my flow was great. Again, I was told it has changed because with the Botox my bladder isn't pulsating (my word) like it did when I had OAB. I was also told the remaining urine would cause another UTI. FWIW, this is the fourth urologist who has treated me in six years. This is the first time with this urologist I have wondered about the outcome of an appointment to answer my questions/concerns.

I staying alert to any UTI symptoms. Hope this helps you.
 
Fleemore and Snow a long time ago I read here that botox has a point where this urinary retention becomes an issue.
In other words Botox works until it doesn't.
Presumably the effect of Botox wears of on time
 
@Maymay941, you are correct. Depending on the individual Botox can last up to six months. At that point, another injection would be needed. As this was my first time with this, I'll have to wait to see have this works for me.
 
Fleemore i meant as a life long treatment it seems to stop being effective after multiple uses and urinary retention can happen at that point.
I just remember reading that waa others experience.

Snow has used botox for some time i believe.

But certainly i would lean on a urologist for guidance on this or any treatment im just relaying what i learn from forum users experience.
 
Thank you everyone. @Boomersway a diazepam suppository sounds nice so they can get that my bladder to relax. Does the suppository go into your urethra directly? A female’s urethra hole is like just a little pinprick of a hole; super duper tiny, not sure a pill could fit in there. I’m definitely going to make sure I talk to or see my urologist again today. I think I have retention. My pee is increasingly cloudy. I have been reassured by my various urologists throughout life that there’s actually no reason why Botox should stop working for those of us with true Neurogenic Bladder because people get Botox in their faces for decades and decades and it never stops working. I’ve had it in my trapezius muscles and neck to treat migraines for a decade and it hasn’t lost any efficacy. I’ve been getting it in my bladder for six or seven years and I’ve never had an issue.

I think that maybe because my urologist knows the injections hurt me a lot that instead of giving me the standard 44 injections, she narrowed it down to eight or 10 – I wasn’t counting – trying to be nice to me - but instead ended up putting up too much in just one part of my bladder.

I noticed overnight when I took my muscle relaxer for sleep for my bones that it helped my bladder. So did laying on my side. I don’t want to do that all day for the next month, though. I think resting is going to happen, though.

@lorumipsum Generally, it takes 14 days of Botox to start really working, to be at max bladder muscle paralysis. One does have to strain harder during the first two weeks following those first 14 days. But I’ve still always been able to get 100% flow. Personally, I would rather strain a little with my typical Botox dosing than to be awake every 5 to 20 minutes every night. Not getting Botox is not an option for me. Botox is for life for me if I ever want any sleep. If you can’t sleep, every other part of your body breaks down and I think it’s a good part of the reason why so much of my body is soooooo broken down at such a young age: because I’ve slept very little and like crap my whole life.

Let’s keep this topic open and see what we think is going on. let’s let each other know what our Urologists say and I wish you all the best. I don’t mind those first two weeks of a little bit of retention and having to squeeze harder but I do mind this totally frozen bladder bomb sitting in my lower abdomen.

As for OB/GYN stuff, yes, @Boomersway I, like you, now have the horrible delight of having a yeast infection that I’ve now got to treat separately, oh joy.
 
I have had 100 units of Botox many times. When it stopped working, I took a year off. When it works, it works great. My issue is bladder pain (Interstitial Cystitis). I can live with the frequency, but the pain is excruciating and the Botox takes it away if only for 2-3 months.
 
Hi Snow to answer your first question:If you got to much Botox you simply can’t pee. This is a pretty common problem for men and sometimes also for women.

For this reason you are normally trained for self cath bevor the procedure and it’s a good idea to have every thing at home before hand - just not to end up in the ER on a weekend due to retention…

And yes - it can make sense to try it with in case of neurogenic bladder problems - how ever this strongly depends on the problem itself.
 
Hi @snow, I hope things settle down for you. When I had my injections (mainly for pain and hopes for incon), I felt internally beat up for about a week, more so in my bladder.

My initial (only) dose followed your general thoughts that it gradually required you (I) to use more forceful pressure to empty over 2 weeks though a month sometimes to see the full effect. When I could void, it was by using my abdominal muscles. Look up Valsalva Maneuver.

However, over a short period (days) afterwards I was not able to empty with valsalva maneuvers and had to use catheters exclusively for 7 months. To say you will adapt is unfair but, it is what you end up having to do.

There are different catheter coatings and sizes so, find what is most comfortable to you. I found rubber (reusable) to hurt the most. Products that are hydrophilic coated are the best. SpeediCath, Hollister are two brands. Also, I encourage you insist to your doctor for trying different brands and diameters from pediatric (<12) to adult (12-16).

Best wishes.

Edited for grammar, ugh.
 
@Kathylp. Yep, the pain is excruciating. People think I should just lay in bed and piss my diaper deliberately in the middle of the night all through the night but that’s not what it’s about. I get woken up with extreme bladder spasms if I don’t get Botox. It’s not an option for me not to get it. None of the medication make any difference whatsoever.
 
@MichaelDahlke Self cathing works !!!for men!!! You’re used to holding your penises in your hands. Your whole sex and pee organs are outside of your body. It does not work for women. We have to manage to hold a mirror, spread apart our legs with our two arms, spread apart our innermost vaginal lips with those same two hands while also holding a mirror and somehow very cleanly, insert a catheter into our teeny tiny urethras that are the size of the smaller pinprick end of the smallest safety pin?! There’s nothing outside of our body for us to hold onto to thread a self-catch like there is for you, so there’s no solution except for us to end up in the hospital! Women *cannot* self-cath unless we have a partner spreading our legs, lips, and holding a mirror for us, while we thread the catheter in. And I do not have a partner!
 
I’m going back to the urologist to get more scans and tests today. I completely quit consuming fluid yesterday at 6:00 p.m. because I’m so damn sick of the pain and pressure.
 
Good luck Snow. I hope the Botox wears off quickly in hopes it’ll bring some comfort. I now know that I’ll never go there.
 
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