KEGELS do nothing over 8 months; Pelvic Floor Exercises do NOTHING.

[Archives1]

Kegels have done NOTHING for me for 8 months. And this was after a benign BPH special laser procedure.

The doctor is one of the few that do this TuLep (similar to the HoLep laser, but newer), and considered an expert. However, he has done nothing for me, after giving me his email and encouraging me to contact him, only for me to experience that he doesn't bother to answer but one of my emails.

Then I just finally got in, after waiting forever for an appointment, with a referral from my primary for a "30 minute face-to-face time with patient, only to have a very pushy nurse practitioner do the ultrasound to verify I had no urinary retention in my bladder. Then she proceeds to sloppily and wrongly give me what the doctor said I needed - pelvic floor exercises.

I get ONE sheet with 3 exercises, lifting legs slightly off floor and holding them that way; laying on the floor and lifting the pelvic area, and squeezing a pillow between by legs tightly.

NONE OF THESE go to the pelvic muscles. I can tell, because there is no tightening of the sphincter or area just in front of it, as Kegels are described.

Anyone have experience with Pelvic Floor exercises that stopped their partial incontinence?

 

[Archives1]

The nurses name wasn't Terry, was it?

 

[Archives1]

Kegels very much improved my OAB and incontinence. I’m sorry, by contrast, you’ve received inadequate care. Please don’t judge every provider by your inadequate providers. Please move on to a different hospital system. I wish you better success in your future.

 

[Archives1]

I am seeing a pelvic floor PT. Had radical prostectomy in Nov 2019. Been very slow getting better.

 

[Archives1]

Hi @olwi, I agree that it's time to move on to a different doctor; from what you describe it doesn't sound like this outfit is giving you the time and attention you need. If it were me I would treat going to the new doctor almost like getting a second opinion. I would ask the doctor what I could expect from the prescribed kegels and try to find out when you might see improvement. And also try to talk to a therapist who specializes in kegels and pelvic floor exercises. Do tell somebody, the new doctor or therapist, about your concerns that the exercises don't seem to be going to the pelvic muscles or tightening the sphincter or other nearby areas. Do let them know that.

 

[Archives1]

I agree. Ask them what you can expect, dont give them the answers

 

[Archives1]

As my post described, when I am doing those three pelvic floor exercises, I feel NOTHING, no tightening of any kind in the area of the pelvic floor, which is from the anal sphincter forward to the base of the penis.

I looked up other sites, and found the exact same exercises, plus a number of others. But, enough is enough. Completely different exercises, and ones that I can feel stress in my body that is not healthy, I am not going to do.

I forgot to mention that the "Squeezing a pillow or hard plastic roll between your legs" caused me horrendous hip pain, which I already suffer from every night. I'm a side sleeper, and every 1-1/2 hours or so, I wake up from the pain near/at the top of my femur, and have to change sides, only to have it occur again on that side. And, I sleep on a 4 inch memory foam mattress topper, or I'd never be able to sleep.

Plus, I found two others that I have done as well, but before describing them, here is a description of the bones of the legs:

The lower leg is comprised of two bones, the tibia and the smaller fibula. The thigh bone, or femur, is the large upper leg bone that connects the lower leg bones (knee joint) to the pelvic bone (hip joint)
[/b]

(1) On your knees, with your lower leg vertically straight up from the floor, life up your butt and your back, until they are a straight, slanted plane

(2) On your knees, with your lower leg vertically straight, arch your back up without moving from your position for 10 seconds.

On ALL of these exercises, I can virtually squeeze around the anal sphincter area, as the exercises are doing nothing of the sort.

It is hard to believe that THESE are the exercises claimed to strengthen the pelvic floor.

Common sense alone tells you that if you feel nothing happening in that area, and you can actually squeeze your sphincter area while you are in those positions, shows they are doing nothing for the pelvic floor.

 

[Archives1]

Hi @olwi How many times a day do you do these? Not knowing your schedule, I may guess that you may need to do them more frequently. And you've always learned when you start out to do any kind of exercise you soon find out you have muscles you didn't even know you had! Has that ever happened during kegels?
I still think your best bet is to talk to the doctor at least to see if there is some physiological reason why this isn't doing the trick for you. Definitely ask why you don't feel any tightening.

 

[Archives1]

Hi billiveshere,

I've been doing them 2-3 times (10 repetitions each time).

The only muscle discovery I had (which I was never even told to try to feel for it) is that I originally simply squeezed the very sphincter itself. I later found that I could squeeze more anteriorally (closer to the base of the penis), but that is the only discovery of "finding out you have muscles you didn't even know you had.."'

The doctor, though quite pleasant, doesn't conduct a visit in any way I would expect from a doctor. He never examines me, touches me, simply talks to me in his suit.

The strangest thing about this doctor, originally from Italy, though perfectly fluent in English with no understanding issues, is obviously intelligent, but has some strange bedside manner.

On top of this, I need out-of-network referrals to see him, which are not easy to get approved, plus he is at a State Hospital, where he has chosen to be, rather than one of the top hospitals because "he is interested in helping the underpriviledged", rather than be at the top-ranked hospitals in the area.

He originally gives me his email address and ENCOURAGES me to write him at any time and he will answer. In writing him 5 times over 8 months, I received but ONE response, all others not responded to. This was one of the first things I confronted him about during this only 2nd visit since surgery, and his response was, "I wanted to talk to you in person." Please, if you ask the patient to email you and that you will respond, you don't respond in this manner, which sounds like an excuse answer, which I find disingenous.

 

[Archives1]

@olwi Very well spoken! I agree with you about your physician’s disingenuity.

 

[Archives1]

Thanks, Snow.

Since posting, I'm exhausted from searching for pelvic floor exercises. Most are female-oriented, though many of them seem applicable to males, as many are variations of the ones I listed.

It seems impossible to decide on which ones to do, and I can't possibly see myself doing 10 different exercises. I don't think this is 'lazy', it is just how much time and effort can a person do every day, with 10 repeats on each one, and then multiply that x3 sets. It's simply too much.

 

[Archives1]

Good evening @olwi, If this doctor makes you uncomfortable in any way, please find another! I've been known to do that myself. And just the fact you said he has a strange bedside manner raises a red flag for me! And I wouldn't feel that if a doctor just sits there and talks and doesn't even examine you then something is missing! Does he even take your blood pressure or order lab work? I agree that doing 10 different exercises is a bit much. Surely another doctor and a physical therapist can help you determine which exercises are best for your particular needs. I hope that helps because you, as a patient, have every right to feel satisfied with your care and if they can't deliver then you're outta there!

 

[Archives1]

@olwi I used to sort of know how to Kegels since I was a teenager, given that they have to be flexed for a female to have an orgasm. But when I had official PT for Kegels, I learned much more, including how to use my breath to know if I’m flexing the correct muscles, and to flex them more profoundly. Have you worked with a PT?

Those exercises on your knees sound like hell. I’ve already had surgeries on both knees and kneeling is out of the question!

———————————————————————

I have a (shy) question for you guys. Say you have an erection and flex the muscle that bounces your penis up and down (which feels amazzzzzzzzing inside the vagina during sex!) - is that your pelvic floor muscle, or is that some other muscle? If so, I recommend doing Kegels just to improve your sex life!

 

[Archives1]

I had radical prostectomy in Nov2019. Leaked massively had no control. Tried everything dr said was no help. Have been seeing pelvic floor pt. Had to get the right exercises and legal s the correct way for my issues. I am now 2-3 pads a day. Was changing all the time w diapers.

You need the right help. You need the right pelvic floor pt. The first two did not help. This one more expensive. But works.

 

[Archives1]

Cnswell

Sorry to hear what you've went through. I'm lucky that I didn't need a radical prostectomy, for which I thank God frequently.

I guess I'll have to try the physical therapist route, which is difficult for me, as they want you to come there 3x a week. I went to one for my back years ago, and gave up, because her exercises were simply too much for me to handle, and I questioned how good she was. You never know who you are going to get. Everyone needs and deserves someone who is an expert and knows how to treat your condition. Unfortunately, that is not how our medical system operates. People go to school to learn a profession, and they can get through to graduation, and yet lack much skill or insight.

 

[Archives1]

I go every 2 weeks Should not need more than once every week for 2-3 weeks Then every other Ten less often.

 

[Archives1]

Needs to be a pt for pelvic floor. A specialty

 

[Archives1]

Hi Olwi,
The info below, about why Kegels alone don't work, is from a site that helps women with urinary incontinence, but it also works for men with the optional rectal adaptor:

Quite simply, if you have incontinence, the pelvic floor muscles have gotten so weak that you cannot contract them well on your own, because of a process called muscle inhibition. Further, most people who try to do Kegel exercises to contract their weak pelvic floor muscles end up cheating (unbeknownst to them) by using other muscles. Dr. Norm’s Fem-Tone contracts the right muscles, each and every time, effortlessly giving you perfect Kegels.
voluntary Kegel exercise alone will give you only a 40% contraction of the muscles, but the Fem-Tone device can activate up to 90% of the muscle
most people do a measly dozen or so clenches, which will not change much…the Fem-Tone unit will give you hundreds of contractions

Here is the website
https://stopfemaleincontinence.com/shop/

 

[Archives1]

hi MartineLevesque30

I read about these electrical stimulator devices. Many people and sites say they don't work well, and that manual exercises work better, or, at best, just as well. Almost every one of these types of products are made for WOMEN with incontinence after childbirth.

The device you refer to, Dr. Norm's Fem-Tone, is over-priced, in my opinion. $200 + $70 for male attachment, uses batteries (which add to the cost, as I'm sure you go through many), and has a one-year warranty.

So many products like this are made cheaply, and not to last.

I disagree with you that "most people who try to do Kegel exercise to contract their weak pelvic floor muscles end up cheating...by using other muscles. Doing Kegels is rather simple to learn the technique of. By their very definition and description (and I've read many), if you squeeze the muscles of your anal sphincter, and then also "feel into the squeeze" and move it forward to the shaft of your penis - those are the pelvic floor muscles.]

I done enough of these to have figured it out. But I appreciate your thoughts.

 

[Archives1]

@olwi I saw your post to Cnsweel and I think seeing a PT would be the way to go, or at least consult with one to see if they can help you. I read your concerns about their qualifications loud and clear and when you get names check to see what their degrees are and in what field they have expertise. On other posts we have discussed therapists who go to diploma mills and they get a "degree" in one year. You want someone who's the real thing and earned an advanced degree and certifications in the area of expertise you are seeking. Check with a nearby university or medical center to see what kind of credentials the therapy staff has. You want somebody who can give you the results you want in an effective but safe manner. Taking it a step further you can even ask the therapist is she can give you the names of patients who have had what you are looking for and willing to talk to you about their experiences.